A kernel of hope, food as communication and the ‘now or never’ behind change in BAFTA-nominated ‘Bus Girl’: an interview with director Jessica Henwick

Interview by David Kam

Ahead of the BAFTA awards ceremony on Feb 19, we spoke with actor, writer and director Jessica Yu-Li Henwick, of Bus Girl which has been nominated for Best British Short Film. Bus Girl tells the story of an aspiring young female chef as she navigates the cutthroat world of high end cooking. Marking Jessica’s directorial debut, Bus Girl has moved fans and critics alike for the kernel of hope it represents to those pursuing a dream, and for its rich Wong Kar-Wai inspired aesthetics achieved by filming entirely on a Xiaomi Mi11 phone.

Jessica shared what it was like to capture London through the lens of an 18 year old, having her family on set, and why it was important for her to prioritise her short film over the invitation to join the cast of Glass Onion: A Knives Out Mystery.

Watch our video interview or read the transcript below!

David: Hi, Jess. I'm David from besea.n, Britain's East and South East Asian Network. It's really nice to meet you.

Jess: Nice to meet you. Thank you for having me.

David: Before anything else, I want to congratulate you on the making of Bus Girl. As a fellow creative myself, the making of it is already such an achievement. With this short now being recognised in so many different places, and most significantly now, BAFTA which is happening this Sunday... Congratulations!

Jess: Thank you. Yeah, it was a real surprise. We didn't know it was coming, so I didn't watch the announcement live. Then, when they did make the announcement for the long list, they didn't list our names. They just said Bus Girl, and so my producer called me. She was like, "Do you think that's us?" So then we were on the internet, trying to find out if there are other short films called Bus Girl so that we could check the video. We didn't want to get our hopes up. But yeah, it turned out to be us.

David: Of course, and it must be such a surreal experience. What does this BAFTA mean to you and how is it significant?

Jess: Wow I mean, I think for a really long time, I've carried this weight of "Oh, the UK has never accepted me", like the entertainment industry here never accepted me. You know, I didn't look British enough or didn't sound British enough. Or I didn't, I don't act very British. So I think I didn't realise how much of a complex I had about that, about my lack of acceptance at home. To be recognised on this level has kind of lifted that.

I had a BAFTA event last night and I met some local filmmakers. And I just was continuously surprised because they, I was like, "Oh my God, they know who I am and they have seen my work." Yeah, it was just... it's been so much affirmation in such a short space of time that I felt quite overwhelmed by it really.

David: Yeah, I mean, especially if it's something that you have said you haven't expected, and now to be recognised and validated by people you respect and by the industry. In a way, it must be a lot to process.

Jess: It is, and I'm sure that I will be processing this for the next few months, regardless of what happens on Sunday night.

David: Exactly, and what I really appreciate with this acknowledgement, this recognition as well, is that it really shows how the quality of a film really does not depend on the amount of resource that you have. Because I know, with this short, everything was filmed using the Xiaomi phone. I think it's incredibly impressive that quality wise, it absolutely stands against all of the other films that were nominated. Not only that, I think with this recognition, what I personally appreciate is that it really shows Asians in a creative light, which is something that's not really often shown. So I'm absolutely rooting for the film as you go ahead for this weekend.

Talking more about the way that you filmed this short with the Xiaomi phone, I recognise a lot of Wong Kar Wai references in the aesthetics of it and I wonder if you have any other sources of inspiration heading into creating this film?

June on a bus ride home at the end of her work shift

Jess: Yeah, I think any Asian director goes through a Wong Kar Wai phase. It's like a rite of passage. He's one of the most iconic prolific directors of all time. And I mean, my favourite film is Chungking Express. So I love his work. I have his book, which is The Cinema of Wong Kar Wai.

Another filmmaker... well, what some people haven't caught is that the opening scene is an homage to the opening scene in Eat Drink Man Woman. It's just an homage in the fact that the meal that she makes is quite similar to the meal that he (the father) makes in Eat Drink Man Woman, but this is obviously the daughter making it for her mother. For me, that scene is really about how much Asian culture relies on food as a form of communication.

I don't know if you've experienced this, but certainly when I was a kid (my mother is Singaporean), if my mother and I argued, we weren't very good at saying "I'm sorry", but what we would do is, you know, my mom would go slice up a plate of fruit and she'd come bring me the fruit. That was how he apologised. If we had something to celebrate, it was like, "Okay, let's go make a Peking duck". If we were sad, our food was sad. So much of our language revolved around what we were eating and cooking for each other. I wanted to make a reference to that in the opening of the film.

David: Yeah, and I definitely resonate. I'm actually from Malaysia, and I think the way I communicate with not just my parents but my siblings, are always through acts of service in one way, and we don't usually use words much. I think that's why when it comes to having watched the short, amongst the lines that I really resonate with... (Aside from "I'm an oyster which I found really funny), the line that really got me was when you said, "Work was good" at the end of the short and I almost just bawled because you see your character June going through an experience similar to what you're going through in real life now. The sense of validation, of something that you care so much about, and not really knowing where to share and convey that. All that being contained in just these three words, through a phone call to your mom.

It really got me, just thinking back when I'm working away from Malaysia and how I communicate with my family. Is this moment something that came from a personal experience? Is there a specific intention why you wanted to convey this?

Jess: Well, it's a few things. So, on one hand, what I wanted to do with that line is... I like short films which are about the fleetingness and beauty in fleetingness. This is something that happens one night that will change her life, but not in the way that you expect. She goes back to work tomorrow and she's still cleaning the rubbish bins and she's still cleaning tables. She's still not a chef. She still has a fraught relationship with her mother. Her mother still wants her to go back to school.

So in many ways, her life has not changed. But the way that it has changed is that she has this kernel of hope, this seed that this critic has planted in her head. And that memory of this one night is going to nourish her dream for the next few years as she goes through the late nights and the terrible pay and the awful bosses. This is what will keep her hope alive. And so that's really what that is. It's like it was a really big thing on the outside. But really, it was just a big thing on the inside. There's not much to say. And it was just for her, you know that moment was just for her. It wasn't about getting affirmation from her mother or getting affirmation from anyone else. Because now she has a belief in herself that's reinforced.

Something I wanted going into the film I said, you know, I want to capture... We've seen a lot of London as a grey, rainy, miserable, gritty place. We've seen the crime, on screen I mean, we've seen the darkness. But I feel like we very rarely get to see London through the lens of an 18 year old. And I remember when I moved, I moved to London when I was 16 and... same I dropped out of school. So it was quite a lot of parallels. But I dropped out of school, I moved to London and... I remember thinking this city was so beautiful and the possibilities were so endless and it really was like this. London is what you make of it. If you put your heart and soul into London, London will give back. And I felt like that hadn't been seen on screen before.

So I wanted to capture that feeling in that last scene of like, this night of hope meant the world to her. Thank you for saying that. I'm glad it worked.

The food critic during a fateful night in London

David: Absolutely. I think if anything this short feels like another tangible kernel of hope that aspiring creatives or anyone who has a similar orbit could watch to fuel themselves. Speaking of affirmation, being someone working in the wellness industry, I really quite enjoyed watching June on the bus, listening to words of affirmation to get into the headspace of "Okay, I'm gonna go to work". And I don't know if it's intentional, but then it's also nice that on the way back from work, it's just quiet, it feels like there's a level of contentment there and there's no extra motivation needed. And of course, as you've said, affirmation couldn't quite come from her mum in this case. Now I wonder when, in your own life, where were the sources that kept your motivation level high?

Jess: Well, I will say that the mother, my mum is nothing like June's mom. So my mum has really been a massive source of inspiration for me my entire life and believed in me even when I didn't believe in me. So incredibly supportive of me leaving school, entering an industry which you know, culturally, is not really supported. But my mom was always like, "No, this is what you're meant to do. Like you go for it. You're meant to be in the creative arts. This is your thing", which is incredible. So yeah, I would say that she's been the biggest influence in terms of affirmation.

David: Yeah, just to have someone believing in you, even when you don't believe in yourself, I think it's so key. And even if it's not a parent, or a family member, but a friend or a teacher, I think that sometimes really changes the way you tread on a path that might feel quite lonely.

Jess: And I think because everyone, I mean, my dad, for starters, was not supportive. My teachers weren't supportive. My acting teacher wasn't supportive. I think I actually got a D in acting when I was at school. So it wasn't written in the cards. I tried all different things like piano, I tried dance and singing and all that... All of my teachers were like, "Nah, she's not gonna make it." The kids I went to school with... very brutal about that stuff. There was so much negativity everywhere. I think you do just need one person in your corner. If I didn't have that, I don't know if I would have continued. I will however say, though, that I also feel incredibly shaped by the no's, by the people who didn't support me. It helped me to develop a very tough skin, which is so necessary in this industry. You really have to have a tough skin. So I thank them just as much as I thank the people who said yes.

David: Absolutely. But when it comes to support, I can't help but notice in the credits of the short that there's quite a few Henwicks in there. So it feels like a bit of a family affair as well. How is that like to be able to work on this project with so many of your family?

Jess: Yeah... I mean, it's amazing. Both in this one, both my brothers helped. My younger brother, Josh is a chef in the kitchen. Or at least he's a dishwasher. My older brother did behind the scenes photography and also he works at a production house. So he is very technically savvy, which I feel is my downfall. So he was really able to help guide me, not as much in BUS GIRL. But in the sequel, he was really a technical consultant for the phone. And then my mom was an extra and I think she helped out a little bit in costumes at one point when we were shooting.

So yeah, it's lovely to have them be a part of my career and it's really hard to do when you're just... When I'm acting in other people's projects, it's like quite hard to bring your family to set and be like, "See, this is what I do." Especially now with COVID, the protocols are so harsh, but when I was directing, I was like, "I'm gonna let them all come. They can come as many days as they want." They had fun and they even said at some point, like, "Whoa, you're, you're the boss. This is your domain."

It was like a sort of switch had flipped. When I was, I think I just knew, because we only shot for three days and I knew the scope of this was quite large and I had to be on it. We could not go a day behind because I didn't have time to do any pickups. And so it was really, it was so laser focused. I think for that week that I was in London, I slept like three hours a night and it didn't matter because I had so much adrenaline and drive... I couldn't eat. I just lived and breathed the film and that was what fed me. But it was nice for them to see it. To see me in my element, so to speak, I think.

David: Yeah... like so fully in it. As you've said, you're not only directing this. You wrote this, and then you're also acting in it. And with that, having the presence of your family witness you doing all that... Must be a lot to handle in one moment.

Behind the scenes of ‘BUS GIRL’

Jess: Yeah, it was a lot. I mean, I wasn't supposed to act in it. That was an accident. It was meant to be that I just... I wrote it and then I was meant to direct it. I cast actually another Asian actress in the lead. And then just before filming, her agents came to us and they said, "Look, she's on hold for Netflix." The filming dates didn't clash at all but Netflix were just so afraid that she might get COVID on the weekend that she shot with us that they were just like, "We're just gonna not release her". So she dropped out and then basically, I got to the stage where I thought I'm gonna lose the funding if I couldn't find anyone. So I just thought, "Okay, I have to step in myself and do it". It was really the last thing I wanted because I didn't want people to think it was like a vanity project. I wanted people to take me seriously as a director. But it worked out and I'm actually really glad with the way it happened.

David: Yeah, I thought you managed it so well. I just really enjoyed the character June. The way you've portrayed her has really hit deep with me and just recognising these experiences within my own life as well. I know when we talk about scheduling conflict, that you were also in the midst of filming Glass Onion at the same time and that you had to quite fiercely protect the space of "Well I still want to make sure I do Bus Girl". Why is it significant, especially at that point for you when you already have such a huge project?

Jess: Well, I had come up with Bus Girl months before Glass Onion. I'd already secured the cast and got the dates back then. I had figured it out. So when Glass Onion came, and I'm so glad I did that film... It was a beautiful process and I love Ryan, the director... But when Glass Onion came, I said, "You guys have to let me go. Otherwise, I can't do this film. Like I've made a commitment." And yeah, people did think I was crazy because it's a multi-million dollar franchise in comparison to my tiny little short, that isn't even the catering budget of Glass Onion. The reason I protected it so fiercely was because I had been talking about directing for so many years and then what happens is... and I think this is most people's experience when they have sort of a dream, that their normal life will continue to try to stop change.

So everytime I was about to direct something or if I was thinking about directing something, acting would come along and then it's like, "Oh, well, I can't do it now, because I'm on a six month shoot in New York or whatever"... which I'm very grateful for. This is... champagne problems. But when it came up, I thought, "I've made a commitment. I either have to do it now or it's never". This is the test of me. If I folded at the first sign of Glass Onion, then to me, that's a reflection of "Deep down, I just want to be an actor". But the fact that I cared so much about it made me realise I've taken some of the power away from acting, because for a long time, I was very focused on acting. And in the last few years, something has changed and I'm now more interested in telling stories.

Finding the right shot from a Xiaomi Mi11 phone

I think it's growing up and I think it's also... You know the reason I started writing was I was incredibly jaded by what was on show; for women of colour, for women of a certain age. It just... It really depressed me. And so rather than complaining, like, "Oh, there's not enough Asian stories, I want to be a part of the change. I want to put my money where my mouth is". And that had really solidified these past few years. I think if Glass Onion had come to me three years ago, I would have just cancelled the short film.

David: Yeah, it's so useful what you said in how, for change to happen, you just really need to make space. And when you do, sometimes you realise that it's not necessarily an either/or. In your case, it was a both/and. You got to do both and enjoy the best of both the acting part and Bus Girl is everything including a family affair, which must be so special. Above anything else, just being able to spend time with your family and them witnessing you in your full element. I think that's something I personally wouldn't have even traded for anything else. So yeah, I'm really happy to just witness all of this.

I just have one final wildcard question for you, which is also part of the credits. I can't help but notice Gudetama, which is a really popular Japanese cartoon, sitting in there within an egg whisk on your credit. Was there an influence of any sort or is it just a little tease of what's to come?

Jess: That's so funny that you've noticed that. No one has brought that up to me at all and I think it's weird. I don't know why no one's mentioned it, that it's in the credits. So Xiaomi, the company who created our phones, I guess they're friends with a bunch of these other companies. And so they came to set to do a set visit. They bought these toys and they put them around the set and they said, "Oh, this would be funny". Myself and the crew became kind of obsessed with toys. So it really has no relevance to anything in the story. It's not a symbol of anything... I like that people think it might be so maybe I should have left it out there. But honestly, it's just that we thought it was cute and we liked it. So we just picked a couple and we said, "Why don't we just put it in the credits because it's funny". So we did!

David: Yeah, I loved it. I think it's always nice to have an element of fun and play in the process of what you're doing even if it's not central to the idea. I think it actually does fit with the aesthetic, with the colours as well. It feels like with the sense of humour that's in the short, it sort of fits quite nicely.

Jess: It does work. But it's just funny that no one's mentioned it because I would ask the same thing. I'd be like, "Why are those in the credits"? But if you look closely in the film, you might be able to catch them hidden in the back of set. Yeah. And they make a reappearance in the sequel that we made, Sandwich Man. We bought them back.

David: Amazing. I definitely can't wait to watch it again and pick out where Gudetama is in every scene. I know we can watch it on YouTube now through the BAFTA channel. Is that right?

Jess: Yes if you're watching this, I would love to hear what you think. We're streaming on BAFTA for another week and then it will go dark. I don't know when we're planning to put it up after that. So now's the time to watch if you want.

David: Yeah, Bus Girl I highly recommend. I've watched it myself about five, six times now. Every time a little bit teary eyed and I always get new layers to it. So I really recommend it.

One final question for you Jess. What's next?

Jess: What next... I'm taking it slow. I don't have any acting things yet. I've been sent a couple things. So I'm reading scripts and I'm taking meetings. I think I'm also trying to figure out when I can next direct because I definitely want to direct... Obviously, not this year. It's too soon, but maybe the end of this year or more likely next year. So I'd love to start getting something into motion. I've been bitten by the bug now and I do want to go back to directing.

David: It feels like the start of a new momentum into this journey and I'm really excited for you.

Jess: Thank you so much. And thank you for having me.

David: Of course and again, all the best ahead of this Sunday. We'll be rooting for you from besea.n and I'm sure we'll be looking at what's happened through the screens, but meanwhile, probably more Bus Girl watches amongst our team.

Jess: Thank you.


Bus Girl is available to stream on BAFTA’s Youtube Channel for one more week.
Keep updated on the rest of Jessica’s The Phone Trilogy including the upcoming Sandwich Man.